Similarities betwixt Ishua and Horus...and other Mythological Messiahs
Before we dissect "The Coming Forth By Day" otherwise known as "The Egyptian Book of the Dead" I think it's important for us to innerstand the Messiah concept and where it may have come from and why every culture seem to have written in their mythological records of a Messiah having visited them. Now the scripture tells us that only 8 people survived the flood, however EVERY culture on the planet have a flood story to tell.
Let us not forget that the Proto-Hebrew Hyksos were the rulers of Egypt and were considered there Gods which would inject many a hebrew concepts into egyptian influence.
There are a couple of places we can look and find That the there would be a coming Messiah and it may have been hidden to you before:
Place one: This resource is available to EVERYONE - The Zodiac
I won't go into detail since that thread already exists in another forum. In a nutshell if you take the The Zodiac from Virgo to Leo each sign tells a story of a Virgin born male who eventually becomes a divine ruler (ergo the Conquering Lion/leo)
Then another place this concept can be found is back in Genesis chapter 5 by taking all the names from Adam to his seed:
Hebrew English
Adam Man
Seth Appointed
Enosh Mortal
Kenan Sorrow;
Mahalalel The Blessed God
Jared Shall come down
Enoch Teaching
Methuselah His death shall bring
Lamech The Despairing
Noah Rest, or comfort.
That's rather remarkable:
Man (is) appointed mortal sorrow; (but) the Blessed God shall come down teaching (that) His death shall bring (the) despairing rest.
There is also another thread about that here already so I won't go into that
Now lets look to the references to Horus in the Book of the Dead (I've underlined the supposed similarities and you would agree that MANY of them are a far reaching attempt on my part) :
The Company of the Gods rejoiced, rejoiced, at the coming of Horus, the son of Osiris, whose heart was firm, the triumphant, the son of Isis, the heir of Osiris."
Let me behold Horus when he is in charge of the rudder [of the Boat of Ra], with Thoth and the goddess Maat on each side of him
Let meals from the sepulchral offerings be given to me in the presence [of Osiris], as to those who are in the following of Horus.
Thou hast gained possession of the sceptre of rule, and the whip, and the rank and dignity of thy divine fathers. Thy heart is expanded with joy, O thou who art in the kingdom of the dead. Thy son Horus is firmly placed on thy throne. Thou hast ascended thy throne as the Lord of Tetu, and as the Heq who dwelleth in Abydos.
I am thy kinsman Horus, I have fought on thy behalf, I have come to thee for thy name's sake.
I am with Horus on the day of dressing Teshtesh. I open the hidden water-springs for the ablutions of Urt-ab. I unbolt the door of the Shetait Shrine in Ra-stau. I am with Horus as the protector of the left shoulder of Osiris, the dweller in Sekhem. I enter in among and I come forth from the Flame-gods on the day of the destruction of the Sebau fiends in Sekhem. I am with Horus on the day[s] of the festivals of Osiris, at the making of offerings and oblations, namely, on the festival which is celebrated on the sixth day of the month, and on the day of the Tenat festival in Anu
May I be a Follower of Horus in Ra-stau, and of Osiris in Tetu; and may I perform all the transformations which my heart may desire to make in every place wherein my Double (KA) wisheth to be.
I am the Horus who taketh possession of his throne for him. His father, the lord of all those who are in the Boat of his Father Horus, hath ascribed praise unto him. He cometh bearing tidings....... let him see the town of Anu. Their chief shall stand on the earth before him, the scribes shall magnify him at the doors of their assemblies, and thy shall swathe im with swathings in Anu. He hath led heaven captive, and he hath seized the earth in his grasp. Neither the heavens nor the earth can be taken away from him, for, behold, he is Ra, the firstborn of the gods. His mother shall nurse him, and shall give him her breast on the horizon.
THE NAMES OF THE GODS OF THE GREAT COMPANY:- 1. Ra Harmakhis, the Great God in his boat. 2. Temu. 3. Shu. 4. Tefnut. 5. Keb. 6. Nut, the Lady of Heaven. 7. Isis. 8. Nephthys. 9. Horus, the Great God. 10. Hathor, Lady of Amentet. 11. Hu. 12. Sa.
Meat offerings and admittance into the presence of the god Osiris shall be granted unto him, together with an abiding habitation in the Field of Offerings (Sekhet-hetepet), as unto the Followers of Horus.
Horus, the son of Isis, saith: I have come to thee, O Un-Nefer, and I have brought unto thee the Osiris Ani. His heart is righteous, and it hath come forth from the Balance; it hath not sinned against any god or any goddess. Thoth hath weighed it according to the decree pronounced unto him by the Company of the Gods, and it is most true and righteous. Grant thou that cakes and ale may be given unto him, and let him appear in the presence of the god Osiris, and let him be like unto the Followers of Horus for ever and ever.
"Yesterday is Osiris, and To-day is Ra, when he shall destroy the enemies of Neb-er-tcher (the lord to the uttermost limit), and when he shall establish as prince and ruler his son Horus.
"They are the drops of blood which came forth from the phallus of Ra when he went forth to perform his own mutilitation. These drops of blood sprang into being under the forms of the gods Hu and Sa, who are in the bodyguard of Ra, and who accompany the god Tem daily and every day. "I, Osiris the scribe Ani, whose word is truth, have filled for thee the utchat (the Eye of Ra, or of Horus), when it had suffered extinction on the day of the combat of the Two Fighters (Horus and Set)."
It was the combat which took place on the day when Horus fought with Set, during which Set threw filth in the face of Horus, and Horus crushed the genitals of Set. The filling of the utchat Thoth performed with his own fingers. "I remove the thunder-cloud from the sky when there is a storm with thunder and lightning therein."
"Mehurt is the great Celestial Water, but others say that Mehurt is the image of the Eye of Ra at dawn at his birth daily. "[Others, however, say that] Mehurt is the utchat of Ra. "Now Osiris the scribe Ani, whose word is truth, is a very great one among the gods who are in the following of Horus; they say that he is the prince who loveth his lord."
Who are the gods who are in the train of Horus?
"The chief of the Tchatcha (sovereign princes) who is in Naarutef is Horus, the Advocate of his father. "As concerning the day wherein [Anubis said to the Seven Spirits], 'Come ye hither,' [the allusion here] is to the words 'Come ye hither,' which Ra spake unto Osiris."
"As concerning the Divine Twin-gods they are Heru-netch-her-tefef and Heru-khent-en-Ariti (Horus the Advocate of his father [Osiris], and Horus the sightless). "Others say that the double Divine Soul which dwelleth in the Divine Twin-gods is the Soul of Ra and the Soul of Osiris, and yet others say that it is the Soul which dwelleth in Shu, and the Sould which dwelleth in Tefnut, and that these two Souls form the double Divine Soul which dwelleth in Tetu. "I am the Cat which fought near the Persea Tree in Anu on the night when the foes of Neb-er-tcher were destroyed."
"It is Shesmu, the headsman of Osiris. "[Concerning the invisible god] some say that he is Aapep when he riseth up with a head bearing upon it [the feather of] Maat (Truth). But others say that he is Horus when he riseth up with two heads, whereon one beareth [the feather of] Maat, and the other [the symbol of] wickedness. He bestoweth wickedness on him that worketh wickedness, and right and truth upon him that followeth righteousness and truth. "Others say that he is Heru-ur (the Old Horus), who dwelleth in Sekhem
Who are these Watchers?
"They are Anubis and Horus, [the latter being] in the form of Horus the sightless
"Those who preside over their altars are the similitude of the Eye of Ra, and the similitude of the Eye of Horus. "
"He who was bidden to rule among the gods is the son of Isis (Horus), who was appointed to rule in the room of his father Osiris. "As concerning [the words] 'day of the union of earth with earth,' they have reference to the union of earth with earth in the coffin of Osiris, the Soul that liveth in Hensu, the giver of meat and drink, the destroyer of wrong, and the guide to the everlasting paths."
"Others, however, say that the saffron cakes in Tannt represent heaven and earth, and others say that they represent Shu, the strengthener of the Two Lands in Hensu; and others say that they represent the Eye of Horus,
Lo! medicaments have been brought. Horus purifieth Set and Set strengtheneth, and Set purifieth and Horus strengtheneth.
Hail, saith Horus, O Twenty-first pylon of the Still-Heart! I have made the way. I know thee. I know thy name. I know the name of the goddess who guardeth thee. "Sword that smiteth at the utterance of its own name, stinking face, overthrower of him that approacheth her flame" is thy name. Thou keepest the hidden things of the avenger of the god, thou guardest them. Amam is his name.
I have come unto you, O ye Tchatcha Chiefs who dwell in Rasta, and I have brought unto you the Osiris Ani, grant ye unto him cakes, and water, and air, and a homestead in Sekhet-hetep as to the followers of Horus.
Now the great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in Tetu are Osiris, Isis, Nephthys, and Horus the avenger of his father. Now the "setting up of the Tet in Tetu" signifieth [the raising up of] the shoulder of Horus, the Governor of Sekhem. They are round about Osiris in the band [and] the bandages
Hail, Thoth, who didst make the word of Osiris to be true against his enemies, make thou the word of the Osiris the scribe Ani to be true against his enemies, with the great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in the double town Pe-Tep, on the night of setting up the "Senti" of Horus, and of establishing him in the inheritance of the possessions of his father Osiris.
Now the great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in Pe-Tep are Horus, Isis, Kesta (Mesta) and Hapi. Now the "setting up of the 'Senti' of Horus" hath reference to the words which Set spake to his followers, saying "Set up the Senti."
Now the great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in Taiu-Rekhti are Isis, Horus, Kesta (Mesta) [Anpu and Thoth].
Hail, Thoth, who didst make the word of Osiris true against his enemies, make thou the word of the Osiris, whose word is truth, to be true against his enemies, with the great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in Rasta, on the night when Anpu lay with his arms on the things by Osiris, and when the word of Horus was make to be true against his enemies.
The great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in Rasta are Horus, Osiris, and Isis. The heart of Osiris is happy, the heart of Horus is glad, and the two halves of Egypt (Aterti) are well satisfied thereat.
My heart is with me, and it shall never come to pass that it be carried away. I am the Lord of Hearts, the slayer of the heart-case. I live in truth, I have my being therein. I am Horus, the Dweller in Hearts, [I am] in the Dweller in the body. I have life by my word, my heart hath being. My heart-case shall not be snatched away from me, it shall not be wounded, it shall not be put in restraint if wounds are inflicted upon me. [If] one take possession of it I shall have my being in the body of my father Keb and in the body of my mother Nut. I have not done that which is held in abomination by the gods. I shall not suffer defeat [for] my word is truth.
The Spirits fall headlong in the darkness, but the Eye of Horus hath made me holy, and Upuati hath nursed me
Thou findest the Eye of Horus standing by thee like unto those beings who resemble Osiris, who never lie down in death.
Even if it would tarry, cause thou my Ba-soul to see my body. Thou shalt find the Eye of Horus standing by thee like [the Watchers].
That which lieth down in the closed place is opened by the Ba-soul which is in it. By the Eye of Horus I am delivered.
My limbs are in a flourishing condition. I am Horus, the Avenger of his Father, and I bring the Urrt Crown [and set it on] its standard. The road of souls is opened. My twin soul seeth the Great God in the Boat of Ra, on the day of souls. My soul is in the front thereof with the counter of the years. Come, the Eye of Horus hath delivered for me my soul, my ornaments are stablished on the brow of Ra. Light is on the faces of those who are in the members of Osiris. Ye shall not hold captive my soul. Ye shall not keep in durance my shadow. The way is open to my soul and to my shadow. It seeth the Great God in the shrine on the day of counting souls. It repeateth the words of Osiris. Those whose seats are invisible, who fetter the members of Osiris, who fetter Heart-souls and Spirit-souls, who set a seal upon the dead, and who would do evil to me, shall do no evil to me. Haste on the way to me. Thy heart is with thee. My Heart-soul and my Spirit-soul are equipped; they guide thee. I sit down at the head of the great ones who are chiefs of their abodes. The wardens of the members of Osiris shall not hold thee captive, though they keep ward over souls, and set a seal on the shadow which is dead. Heaven shall not shut thee in.
That which was shut hath been opened [that is] the dead. That which was shut fast hath been opened by the command of the Eye of Horus, which hath delivered me. Established are the beauties on the forehead of Ra
I am Horus, the Avenger of his Father. I am he who bringeth along his father, and his mother, by means of his staff. The way shall be opened to him that hath power over his feet, and he shall see the Great God in the Boat of Ra, when souls are counted therein at the bows, and when the years also are counted up. Grant that the Eye of Horus, which maketh the adornments of splendour to be firm on the forehead of Ra, may deliver my soul for me, and let darkness cover your faces, O ye who would imprison Osiris. O keep not captive my soul.
The Osiris Ani saith:- The town of Unu is opened. My head is sealed up, Thoth. Perfect is the Eye of Horus. I have delivered the Eye of Horus which shineth with splendours on the brow of Ra, the Father of the gods, [I am] that self-same Osiris, [the dweller in] Amentet. Osiris knoweth his day, and he knoweth that he shall live through his period of life; I shall have by being with him. I am the Moon-god Aah, the dweller among the gods. I shall not come to an end. Stand up therefore, O Horus, for thou art counted among the gods.
Open is the land of Unu. Shut is the head of Thoth. Perfect is the Eye of Horus. I have delivered the Eye of Horus, the shining one, the ornament of the Eye of Ra, the Father of the Gods. I am that same Osiris who dwelleth in Amentet. Osiris knoweth his day, which cometh to an end. I am Set, the Father of the Gods. I shall never come to an end.
The Osiris Ani saith:- I am the Lion-god who cometh forth with long strides. I have shot arrows, and I have wounded my prey. I have shot arrows, and I have wounded my prey. I am the Eye of Horus, I traverse the Eye of Horus at this season. I have arrived at the domains. Grant that the Osiris Ani may come in peace.
I stand up like Horus. I sit down like Ptah. I am strong like Thoth. I am mighty like Tem. I walk with my legs. I speak with my mouth. I chase my enemy. He hath been given unto me, and he shall not be delivered from me.
Thou didst send forth the word when the earth was submerged with silence, O thou Only One, who didst dwell in heaven before ever the earth and the mountains came into being. Hail, thou Runner, Lord, Only One, thou maker of the things that are, thou hast fashioned the tongue of the Company of the Gods, thou hast produced whatsoever cometh forth from the waters, thou springest up out of them above the submerged land of the Lake of Horus
Thou shalt behold Horus standing on the pilot's place in the Boat, and Thoth and Maat shall stand one on each side of him. All the gods shall rejoice when they behold Ra coming in peace to make the hearts of the Spirit- souls to live, and the Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, the assessor of the holy offerings of the Lords of Thebes, shall be with them!
The Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, in peace, whose word is truth, is like Horus, the mighty one of transformations.
Thou givest [thy] face to the Hememet spirits, thou god Khepera who dwellest in thy Boat. Thou hast overthrown the Fiend Aapep. O ye Sons of Keb, overthrow ye the enemies of the Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, and the fiends of destruction who would destroy the Boat of Ra. Horus hath cut off your heads in heaven. Ye who were in the forms of geese, your navel strings are on the earth. The animals are set upon the earth..... in the form of fish.
And behold ye, this god, the mighty one of slaughters, the terror of whom is most great, shall wash himself clean in your blood, and he shall bathe in your gore, and ye shall be destroyed by the Osiris Ani in the Boat of his Lord Ra- Horus
His mother Isis giveth birth to him, and Nephthys nurseth him, just as Isis gave birth to Horus, and Nephthys nursed him. [He] shall repulse the Smait fiends of Suti. They shall see the Urrt Crown stablished upon his head, and they shall fall down upon their faces [and worship him]. Behold, O ye Spirit-souls, and men, and gods, and ye dead, when ye see the Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, in the form of Horus, and the favoured one of the Urrt Crown, fall ye down upon your faces. The word of the Osiris Ani is truth before his enemies in heaven above, and on earth beneath, and before the Tchatchau Chiefs of every god and of every goddess.
Osiris unfettereth the storm-cloud in the body of heaven, and is unfettered himself; Horus is made strong happily each day. He whose transformations are many hath had offerings made unto him at the moment, and he hath made an end of the storm which is in the face of the Osiris, Auf-ankh, whose word is truth. Verily, he cometh, and he is Ra in journeying, and he is the four celestial gods in the heavens above. The Osiris Auf-ankh, whose word is truth, cometh forth in his day, and he embarketh among the tackle of the boat.
I am like Horus, the governor of the Boat, when the throne of his father was given unto him, and when Set, that son of Nut, was [lying] under the fetters which he had made for Osiris. He who is in Sekhem hath inspected me
I am one of the worms which have been created by the Eye of the Lord One. And behold, when as yet Isis had not given birth to Horus, I was flourishing, and I had waxed old, and had become pre-eminent among the Spirit-souls who had come into being with him
I rose up like a divine hawk, and Horus endowed me with a Spirit-body with his soul, so that [I] might take possession of the property of Osiris in the Tuat. He shall say to the twin Lion-gods for me, the Chief of the House of the Nemes Crown, the Dweller in his cavern: Get thee back to the heights of heaven, for behold, inasmuch as thou art a Spirit-body with the creations of Horus, the Nemes Crown shall not be to thee: [but] thou shalt have speech even to the uttermost limits of the heavens. I, the warder, took possession of the property of Horus [which belonged] to Osiris in the Tuat, and Horus repeated to me what his father Osiris had said unto him in the years [past], on the days of his burial.
I come forth therefrom into the House of Isis. I look upon the holy things which are hidden. I see the being who is therein. I speak to the great ones of Shu, they repulse him that is wrathful in his hour. I am Horus who dwelleth in his divine Light. I am master of his crown. I am master of his radiance. I advance towards the Henti boundaries of heaven. Horus is upon his seat. Horus is upon his thrones. My face is like that of a divine hawk. I am one who is equipped [like] his lord. I shall come forth to Tetu. I shall see Osiris. I shall live in his actual presence.... Nut. They shall see me. I shall see the gods [and] the Eye of Horus burning with fire before my eyes. They shall reach out their hands to me. I shall stand up. I shall be master of him that would subject me to restraint. They shall open the holy paths to me, they shall see my form, they shall listen to my words.
Horus hath commanded me to lift up your faces; do ye look upon me. I have risen up like a divine hawk. Horus hath made me to be a Spirit-body by means of his Soul, and to take possession of the things of Osiris in the Tuat. Make ye for me a path. I have travelled and I have arrived at those who are chiefs of their caverns, and who are guardians of the House of Osiris.
I see Osiris. I speak to him concerning the matter of his Great Son, whom he loveth, and concerning [the smiting of] the heart of Set. I look upon the lord who was helpless. How shall I make them to know the plans of the gods, and that which Horus did without the knowledge of his father Osiris?
Thy son Horus hath ascended thy trrone, and all life is with him. Millions of years minister unto him, and millions of years hold him in fear. The Company of the Gods are his servants, and they fold him in fear. The god Tem, the Governor, the only One among the gods, hath spoken, and his word passeth not away. Horus is both the divine food and the sacrifice. He made haste to gather together [the members of] of his father. Horus is his deliverer. Horus is his deliverer. Horus hath sprung from the essence of his divine father and from his decay. He hath become the Governor of Egypt. The gods shall work for him, and they shall toil for him for million of years. He shall make millions of years to live through his Eye, the only one of its lord, Nebertcher.]
Thy son Horus hath ascended thy throne. All life is with him. Millions of years work for him. The Company of the Gods fear him. Tem, the One Power of the Gods, hath spoken, and what he hath said is not changed, Hetu Aabi. Horus hath stood up. I have gone about collecting his father. Horus hath delivered his father. Horus hath delivered [his mother]. My mother is Horus. My brother is Horus. My uncle is Horus. I have come. Horus followeth his father.... there the dirt of his head. The gods shall serve him. Millions of years...... in his Eye, the Only One of its Lord, Neb-er- tcher.
Behold, I am the dweller in his terrors, I am the crocodile, his firstborn. I bring (prey) from a distance. I am the Fish of Horus, the Great One in Kamui. I am the lord of bowings in Sekhem.
I flew up out of primeval matter. I came into being like the god Khepera. I germinated like the plants. I am concealed like the tortoise [in his shell]. I am the seed of every god. I am Yesterday of the Four [Quarters of the Earth, and] the Seven Uraei, who came into being in the Eastern land. [I am] the Great One (Horus) who illumineth the Hememet spirits with the light of his body. [I am] that god in respect of Set. [I am] Thoth who [stood] between them (Horus and Set) as the judge on behalf of the Governor of Sekhem and the Souls of Anu. [He was like] a stream between them. I have come. I rise up on my throne. I am endowed with Khu. I am mighty. I am endowed with godhood among the gods. I am Khensu, [the lord] of every kind of strength.
[Here the word Horus is in parenthesis because it doesn't appear in the text it's implied by the author as well as the other words that appear in brackets]
The Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, saith:- I am the holy lotus that cometh forth from the light which belongeth to the nostrils of Ra, and which belongeth to the head of Hathor. I have made my way, and I seek after him, that is to say, Horus. I am the pure lotus that cometh forth from the field [of Ra].
Thy throne hath descended unto thy son Horus, and the god Tem hath decreed that thy course shall be among the holy princes. In truth he shall rule from thy throne, and he shall be heir to the throne of the Dweller in the fiery Lake [Neserser].
And, verily, his son Horus is seated upon the throne of the Dweller in the fiery Lake [of Neserser], as his heir. I have made him to have his throne in the Boat of Millions of Years. Horus is stablished upon his throne [among his] kinsmen, and he hath all that is with him. Verily, the Soul of Set, which is greater than all the gods, hath departed. Let it be granted to me to bind his soul in fetter in the Boat of the God, when I please, and let him hold the Body of the God in fear. O my father Osiris, thou hast done for me that which thy father Ra did for thee. Let me abide upon the earth permanently. Let me keep possession of my throne. Let my heir be strong. Let my tomb, and my friends who are upon the earth, flourish. Let my enemies be given over to destruction, and to the shackles of the goddess Serq. I am thy son. Ra is my father. On me likewise thou hast conferred life, strength, and health. Horus is established upon his tomb. Grant thou that the days of my life may come unto worship and honour
This Chapter shall be recited over a figure of Horus, made of lapis-lazuli, which shall be placed on the neck of the deceased. It is a protection upon earth, and it will secure for the deceased the affection of men, gods, and the Spirit-souls which are perfect. Moreover it acteth as a spell in Khert-Neter, but it must be recited by thee on behalf of the Osiris Ra, regularly and continually millions of times.
Homage to you, O ye who dwell in your Hall of Maati, who have nothing false in your bodies, who live upon Truth, who feed yourselves upon Truth in the presence of Horus who dwelleth in his Disk, deliver ye me from Beba, who feedeth upon the livers of the great ones on the day of the Great Judgment. Grant ye that I may come before you, for I have not committed sin, I have done no act of deceit, I have done no evil thing, and I have not borne [false] witness; therefore let nothing [evil] be done to me. I have lived upon truth, I have fed upon truth, I have performed the ordinances of men, and the things which gratify the gods. I have propitiated the god by doing his will, I have given bread to the hungry man, and water to him that was athirst, and apparel to the naked man, and a ferry-boat to him that had no boat. I have made propitiatory offerings and given cakes to the gods, and the "things which appear at the word" to the Spirits. Deliver then ye me, protect then ye me, and make ye no report against me in the presence [of the Great God]
Thy cakes shall come from the Utchat (Eye of Horus or Ra), thy ale shall come from the Utchat, and the offerings which shall appear to thee at the word upon earth [shall proceed] from the Utc
The buttocks of the Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, are the buttocks of the Eye of Horus
The head of this Meri-Ra is the head of Horus; he cometh forth therefore and ascendeth into heaven.
He worketh the boat; Pepi cometh forth therefore and ascendeth into heaven. [Pepi is] Horus, the nursling, the child; Meri-Ra cometh forth therefore and ascendeth into heaven
He conducteth him to the House of Horus in the sky. The word of his Double is truth before Keb
My buttocks are the buttocks of the Eye of Horus.
I am he who cometh forth advancing, whose name is unknown. I am Yesterday. "Seer of Millions of Years" is my name. I pass along, I pass along the paths of the divine celestial judges. I am the Lord of Eternity: I decree and I judge like Khepera. I am the Lord of the Urrt Crown. I am he who dwelleth in the Utchat and in the Egg, and it is granted unto me to live therein. I am he who dwelleth in the Utchat when it closeth, and I exist by the strength thereof. I come forth and I shine; I enter in and I come to life. I am in the Utchat, my seat is upon my throne, and I sit in the tent chamber before it. I am Horus. [I] traverse millions of years. I have decreed [the stablishing] of my throne, and I am the ruler thereof; and in very truth my mouth keepeth an even balance both in speech and in silence. In very truth my forms are inverted. I am Un-Nefer, from one period even unto another, and what I have is within me. I am the only One, who proceedeth from an only One, who goeth round about in his course. I am he who dwelleth in the Utchat. No evil thing of any shape or kind shall spring up against me, and no baleful object, and no harmful thing, and no disastrous thing shall happen unto me. I open the door in heaven. I rule my throne. I open the way for the births which take place on this day. I am the child who traverseth the road of Yesterday. I am To-day for untold nations and peoples. I am he who protecteth you for millions of years. Whether ye be denizens of heaven, or of the earth, or of the South, or of the North, or of the East, or of the West, the fear of me is in your bodies. I am he whose being hath been wrought in his eye. I shall not die again. My moment is in your bodies, but my forms are in my place of habitation. I am "He who cannot be known." The Red Fiends have their faces directed against me. I am the unveiled one. The period when the heavens were created for me and were enlarged the bounds of earth, and multiplied the progeny thereof, cannot be found out. They shall fail and not be united again. By reason of the speech which I address to you, my name setteth itself apart from all things evil which are in the mouths of men. I am he who riseth and shineth, a wall which cometh out of a wall, an only One who proceedeth from an only One. There is never a day that passeth without the things which appertain unto him being therein; passing, passing, passing, passing. Verily I say unto thee, I am the Plant which cometh forth from Nu, and my mother is Nut. Hail, my creator, I am he who hath no power to walk, the Great Knot who dwelleth in Yesterday. The might of my strength is within my hand, I am not known [by thee], but I am he who knoweth thee. I cannot be held in the hand, but I am he who can hold thee in his hand. Hail, O Egg! Hail, O Egg! I am Horus who liveth for millions of years, whose flame shineth upon you, and bringeth your hearts unto me. I am master of my throne. I advance at this season. I have opened a path. I have delivered myself from all evil things. I am the golden dog-headed ape, three palms and two fingers [high], which hath neither arms nor legs, and which dwelleth in Het-ka-Ptah. I go forth as goeth forth the dog-headed ape who dwelleth in Het-ka-Ptah.
Horus, the son of Isis, shall rejoice when he seeth him. [No] road shall be blocked to him. His hand shall be to heaven, his hand shall be to earth, for ever. Do not let anyone see him. Verily....
If this book be done for him, the magical spells of Isis shall protect him, and Horus the son of Isis shall rejoice [when] he seeth him. No road shall be blocked to him. His hand shall be to heaven, his hand shall be to earth....... If this book be known by him he shall be in the following of Osiris Un-Nefer, and his word shall be truth in Khert- Neter. The doors in Khert-Neter shall be opened to him. Wheat and barley shall be given to him in Sekhet-Aanru. His name shall be like [the names of] the gods who are there, the Followers of Horus who reap.
Thou art Horus, the son of Hathor, Nesert, Nesertet, who giveth back the head after it hath been cut off. Thy head shall not be carried away from thee, after [it hath been cut off]; thy head shall be carried away from thee, never, never!
Thy word is truth in respect of what hath been done unto thee. Ptah hath overthrown thy foes, and thou art Horus, the son of Hathor.]
I am thy son Horus, who loveth thee. I come to avenge thee, O my father Osiris, upon him that did evil unto thee. I have set him under thy feet for ever and for ever, permanently, permanently, O Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, whose word is truth.
Horus vanquished Set when [he] looked at the building of Sekhet-Hetepet. [He] spread air over the Divine Soul in its Egg, in its day. He delivered the interior of the body of Horus [from the Akeru Gods]. I have crowned him in the House of Shu. His house is the stars. Behold, I take up my place in its nomes. He hath guided the hearts of the Company of the Firstborn Gods. He hath reconciled the Two Fighters (Horus and Set),
Set vanguished Horus, who was looking at the building in Sekhet- Hetepet. I set free Horus from Set. Set opened the paths of the Two Eyes (the Sun and Moon) in the sky. Set ejected water with air upon the soul of his Eye, which dwelt in the town of Mert; he delivered the interior of the body of Horus from the hands of the Akeru Gods. Behold me! I paddle this great boat over the Lake of the god Hetep; I seized upon it in the mansion of Shu. The mansion of his stars reneweth youth, reneweth youth. I paddle over the Lakes thereof so that I may arrive at the towns thereof. I sail up to the town of the god Hetep.... Behold, I am at peace with his times, and with his guidance, and with his will, and with the Company of the Gods, who are his firstborn. He maketh the Two Fighters (Horus and Set) to be at peace [with each other], and to keep ward over the living whom he hath created in fair form, and he bringeth peace; he maketh the Two Fighters to be at peace with those who watch over them. He cutteth off the hair from their divine fighters, he driveth away storm from the children
[What liars those egyptologists are. Horus was never crucified, he was slain by Set!]
Horus maketh himself strong like unto a hawk which is one thousand cubits in length, and two thousand cubits in life. He that equipments with him, he journeyeth on, he cometh to the place where his heart would be, among the Lakes which are in its towns. He begetteth in the birth-chamber of the god of the town, he is satisfied with the food of the god of the town; he doeth what ought to be done there, in the Field of Smas-er-Khet..... everything of the birth-chamber of the god of the town. Now [when he] setteth in the [land of] life like crystal he performeth everything therein, [which things are] like unto the things done in the Lake Neserser, wherein there is none that rejoiceth, and wherein are evil things of all kinds.
Behold it (the fire) riseth in Abtu, and it cometh; I cause it to come, the Eye of Horus. It is set in order upon thy brow
The Eye of Horus protecteth thee, O Osiris Khenti-Amenti, and it keepeth thee in safety; it casteth down headlong all thine enemies for thee, and all thine enemies have fallen down headlong before thee.
The Eye of Horus cometh. It is sound and well, it sendeth forth light even as doth Ra in the horizon. It covereth the powers of Suti with darkness, it mastereth him, and it bringeth its flame against him by its own command. The Eye of Horus is sound and well, thou eatest the flesh thereof, thy body possesseth it. Thou acclaimest it
Hail, ye sons of Horus, Kesta, Hapi, Tuamutef, and Qebhsenuf, ye have given your protection to your divine Father Osiris Khenti-Amenti, give ye your protection to the Osiris Nu, whose word is truth. Now therefore, inasmuch as ye have destroyed the Opponent of Osiris Khenti-Amenti, who liveth with the gods, having smitten Suti with his right hand and arm when dawn came upon the earth, and Horus hath become master [of Suti], and hath avenged his divine Father himself; and inasmuch as your divine Father hath been made to flourish through the union of the KA of Osiris Khenti-Amenti, whch ye effected, and the Eye of Horus hath avenged him, and hath protected him, and hath cast down headlong for him all his enemies, and all his enemies have fallen down before him, even so do ye destroy the Opponent of the Osiris Nu, the steward of the overseer of the seal, whose word is truth. Let him live with the gods, let him smite his enemy, let him destroy him, when light dawneth on the earth. Let Horus be master and avenge the Osiris Nu, and let the Osiris Nu flourish through his union with his KA which ye have effected. O Osiris Nu, the Eye of Horus hath avenged thee. It hath cast down headlong all thine enemies for thee, and all thine enemies have been cast down headlong before thee.
Hail, Osiris Khenti-Amenti, grant thou light and fire to the perfect Heart-soul which is in Hensu. And [O ye Sons of Horus], grant ye power unto the living heart-soul of the Osiris Nu by means of his fire
RUBRIC: [This Chapter] shall be recited over four torches of atma cloth, which hath been anointed with the finest Thehennu unguent, and the torches shall be placed in the hands of four men who shall have the names of the pillars of Horus written upon their shoulders,
Whew!!! FINALLY. Finished with that futile and useless chore. I've heard this argument from egyptologists for over 12 years now and the similarities have not increased. There are some subtle similarities but not enough to say Ishua was plagiarized from the story of Horus.
Let us not forget that the Proto-Hebrew Hyksos were the rulers of Egypt and were considered there Gods which would inject many a hebrew concepts into egyptian influence.
There are a couple of places we can look and find That the there would be a coming Messiah and it may have been hidden to you before:
Place one: This resource is available to EVERYONE - The Zodiac
I won't go into detail since that thread already exists in another forum. In a nutshell if you take the The Zodiac from Virgo to Leo each sign tells a story of a Virgin born male who eventually becomes a divine ruler (ergo the Conquering Lion/leo)
Then another place this concept can be found is back in Genesis chapter 5 by taking all the names from Adam to his seed:
Hebrew English
Adam Man
Seth Appointed
Enosh Mortal
Kenan Sorrow;
Mahalalel The Blessed God
Jared Shall come down
Enoch Teaching
Methuselah His death shall bring
Lamech The Despairing
Noah Rest, or comfort.
That's rather remarkable:
Man (is) appointed mortal sorrow; (but) the Blessed God shall come down teaching (that) His death shall bring (the) despairing rest.
There is also another thread about that here already so I won't go into that
Now lets look to the references to Horus in the Book of the Dead (I've underlined the supposed similarities and you would agree that MANY of them are a far reaching attempt on my part) :
The Company of the Gods rejoiced, rejoiced, at the coming of Horus, the son of Osiris, whose heart was firm, the triumphant, the son of Isis, the heir of Osiris."
Let me behold Horus when he is in charge of the rudder [of the Boat of Ra], with Thoth and the goddess Maat on each side of him
Let meals from the sepulchral offerings be given to me in the presence [of Osiris], as to those who are in the following of Horus.
Thou hast gained possession of the sceptre of rule, and the whip, and the rank and dignity of thy divine fathers. Thy heart is expanded with joy, O thou who art in the kingdom of the dead. Thy son Horus is firmly placed on thy throne. Thou hast ascended thy throne as the Lord of Tetu, and as the Heq who dwelleth in Abydos.
I am thy kinsman Horus, I have fought on thy behalf, I have come to thee for thy name's sake.
I am with Horus on the day of dressing Teshtesh. I open the hidden water-springs for the ablutions of Urt-ab. I unbolt the door of the Shetait Shrine in Ra-stau. I am with Horus as the protector of the left shoulder of Osiris, the dweller in Sekhem. I enter in among and I come forth from the Flame-gods on the day of the destruction of the Sebau fiends in Sekhem. I am with Horus on the day[s] of the festivals of Osiris, at the making of offerings and oblations, namely, on the festival which is celebrated on the sixth day of the month, and on the day of the Tenat festival in Anu
May I be a Follower of Horus in Ra-stau, and of Osiris in Tetu; and may I perform all the transformations which my heart may desire to make in every place wherein my Double (KA) wisheth to be.
I am the Horus who taketh possession of his throne for him. His father, the lord of all those who are in the Boat of his Father Horus, hath ascribed praise unto him. He cometh bearing tidings....... let him see the town of Anu. Their chief shall stand on the earth before him, the scribes shall magnify him at the doors of their assemblies, and thy shall swathe im with swathings in Anu. He hath led heaven captive, and he hath seized the earth in his grasp. Neither the heavens nor the earth can be taken away from him, for, behold, he is Ra, the firstborn of the gods. His mother shall nurse him, and shall give him her breast on the horizon.
THE NAMES OF THE GODS OF THE GREAT COMPANY:- 1. Ra Harmakhis, the Great God in his boat. 2. Temu. 3. Shu. 4. Tefnut. 5. Keb. 6. Nut, the Lady of Heaven. 7. Isis. 8. Nephthys. 9. Horus, the Great God. 10. Hathor, Lady of Amentet. 11. Hu. 12. Sa.
Meat offerings and admittance into the presence of the god Osiris shall be granted unto him, together with an abiding habitation in the Field of Offerings (Sekhet-hetepet), as unto the Followers of Horus.
Horus, the son of Isis, saith: I have come to thee, O Un-Nefer, and I have brought unto thee the Osiris Ani. His heart is righteous, and it hath come forth from the Balance; it hath not sinned against any god or any goddess. Thoth hath weighed it according to the decree pronounced unto him by the Company of the Gods, and it is most true and righteous. Grant thou that cakes and ale may be given unto him, and let him appear in the presence of the god Osiris, and let him be like unto the Followers of Horus for ever and ever.
"Yesterday is Osiris, and To-day is Ra, when he shall destroy the enemies of Neb-er-tcher (the lord to the uttermost limit), and when he shall establish as prince and ruler his son Horus.
"They are the drops of blood which came forth from the phallus of Ra when he went forth to perform his own mutilitation. These drops of blood sprang into being under the forms of the gods Hu and Sa, who are in the bodyguard of Ra, and who accompany the god Tem daily and every day. "I, Osiris the scribe Ani, whose word is truth, have filled for thee the utchat (the Eye of Ra, or of Horus), when it had suffered extinction on the day of the combat of the Two Fighters (Horus and Set)."
It was the combat which took place on the day when Horus fought with Set, during which Set threw filth in the face of Horus, and Horus crushed the genitals of Set. The filling of the utchat Thoth performed with his own fingers. "I remove the thunder-cloud from the sky when there is a storm with thunder and lightning therein."
"Mehurt is the great Celestial Water, but others say that Mehurt is the image of the Eye of Ra at dawn at his birth daily. "[Others, however, say that] Mehurt is the utchat of Ra. "Now Osiris the scribe Ani, whose word is truth, is a very great one among the gods who are in the following of Horus; they say that he is the prince who loveth his lord."
Who are the gods who are in the train of Horus?
"The chief of the Tchatcha (sovereign princes) who is in Naarutef is Horus, the Advocate of his father. "As concerning the day wherein [Anubis said to the Seven Spirits], 'Come ye hither,' [the allusion here] is to the words 'Come ye hither,' which Ra spake unto Osiris."
"As concerning the Divine Twin-gods they are Heru-netch-her-tefef and Heru-khent-en-Ariti (Horus the Advocate of his father [Osiris], and Horus the sightless). "Others say that the double Divine Soul which dwelleth in the Divine Twin-gods is the Soul of Ra and the Soul of Osiris, and yet others say that it is the Soul which dwelleth in Shu, and the Sould which dwelleth in Tefnut, and that these two Souls form the double Divine Soul which dwelleth in Tetu. "I am the Cat which fought near the Persea Tree in Anu on the night when the foes of Neb-er-tcher were destroyed."
"It is Shesmu, the headsman of Osiris. "[Concerning the invisible god] some say that he is Aapep when he riseth up with a head bearing upon it [the feather of] Maat (Truth). But others say that he is Horus when he riseth up with two heads, whereon one beareth [the feather of] Maat, and the other [the symbol of] wickedness. He bestoweth wickedness on him that worketh wickedness, and right and truth upon him that followeth righteousness and truth. "Others say that he is Heru-ur (the Old Horus), who dwelleth in Sekhem
Who are these Watchers?
"They are Anubis and Horus, [the latter being] in the form of Horus the sightless
"Those who preside over their altars are the similitude of the Eye of Ra, and the similitude of the Eye of Horus. "
"He who was bidden to rule among the gods is the son of Isis (Horus), who was appointed to rule in the room of his father Osiris. "As concerning [the words] 'day of the union of earth with earth,' they have reference to the union of earth with earth in the coffin of Osiris, the Soul that liveth in Hensu, the giver of meat and drink, the destroyer of wrong, and the guide to the everlasting paths."
"Others, however, say that the saffron cakes in Tannt represent heaven and earth, and others say that they represent Shu, the strengthener of the Two Lands in Hensu; and others say that they represent the Eye of Horus,
Lo! medicaments have been brought. Horus purifieth Set and Set strengtheneth, and Set purifieth and Horus strengtheneth.
Hail, saith Horus, O Twenty-first pylon of the Still-Heart! I have made the way. I know thee. I know thy name. I know the name of the goddess who guardeth thee. "Sword that smiteth at the utterance of its own name, stinking face, overthrower of him that approacheth her flame" is thy name. Thou keepest the hidden things of the avenger of the god, thou guardest them. Amam is his name.
I have come unto you, O ye Tchatcha Chiefs who dwell in Rasta, and I have brought unto you the Osiris Ani, grant ye unto him cakes, and water, and air, and a homestead in Sekhet-hetep as to the followers of Horus.
Now the great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in Tetu are Osiris, Isis, Nephthys, and Horus the avenger of his father. Now the "setting up of the Tet in Tetu" signifieth [the raising up of] the shoulder of Horus, the Governor of Sekhem. They are round about Osiris in the band [and] the bandages
Hail, Thoth, who didst make the word of Osiris to be true against his enemies, make thou the word of the Osiris the scribe Ani to be true against his enemies, with the great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in the double town Pe-Tep, on the night of setting up the "Senti" of Horus, and of establishing him in the inheritance of the possessions of his father Osiris.
Now the great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in Pe-Tep are Horus, Isis, Kesta (Mesta) and Hapi. Now the "setting up of the 'Senti' of Horus" hath reference to the words which Set spake to his followers, saying "Set up the Senti."
Now the great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in Taiu-Rekhti are Isis, Horus, Kesta (Mesta) [Anpu and Thoth].
Hail, Thoth, who didst make the word of Osiris true against his enemies, make thou the word of the Osiris, whose word is truth, to be true against his enemies, with the great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in Rasta, on the night when Anpu lay with his arms on the things by Osiris, and when the word of Horus was make to be true against his enemies.
The great Tchatcha Chiefs who are in Rasta are Horus, Osiris, and Isis. The heart of Osiris is happy, the heart of Horus is glad, and the two halves of Egypt (Aterti) are well satisfied thereat.
My heart is with me, and it shall never come to pass that it be carried away. I am the Lord of Hearts, the slayer of the heart-case. I live in truth, I have my being therein. I am Horus, the Dweller in Hearts, [I am] in the Dweller in the body. I have life by my word, my heart hath being. My heart-case shall not be snatched away from me, it shall not be wounded, it shall not be put in restraint if wounds are inflicted upon me. [If] one take possession of it I shall have my being in the body of my father Keb and in the body of my mother Nut. I have not done that which is held in abomination by the gods. I shall not suffer defeat [for] my word is truth.
The Spirits fall headlong in the darkness, but the Eye of Horus hath made me holy, and Upuati hath nursed me
Thou findest the Eye of Horus standing by thee like unto those beings who resemble Osiris, who never lie down in death.
Even if it would tarry, cause thou my Ba-soul to see my body. Thou shalt find the Eye of Horus standing by thee like [the Watchers].
That which lieth down in the closed place is opened by the Ba-soul which is in it. By the Eye of Horus I am delivered.
My limbs are in a flourishing condition. I am Horus, the Avenger of his Father, and I bring the Urrt Crown [and set it on] its standard. The road of souls is opened. My twin soul seeth the Great God in the Boat of Ra, on the day of souls. My soul is in the front thereof with the counter of the years. Come, the Eye of Horus hath delivered for me my soul, my ornaments are stablished on the brow of Ra. Light is on the faces of those who are in the members of Osiris. Ye shall not hold captive my soul. Ye shall not keep in durance my shadow. The way is open to my soul and to my shadow. It seeth the Great God in the shrine on the day of counting souls. It repeateth the words of Osiris. Those whose seats are invisible, who fetter the members of Osiris, who fetter Heart-souls and Spirit-souls, who set a seal upon the dead, and who would do evil to me, shall do no evil to me. Haste on the way to me. Thy heart is with thee. My Heart-soul and my Spirit-soul are equipped; they guide thee. I sit down at the head of the great ones who are chiefs of their abodes. The wardens of the members of Osiris shall not hold thee captive, though they keep ward over souls, and set a seal on the shadow which is dead. Heaven shall not shut thee in.
That which was shut hath been opened [that is] the dead. That which was shut fast hath been opened by the command of the Eye of Horus, which hath delivered me. Established are the beauties on the forehead of Ra
I am Horus, the Avenger of his Father. I am he who bringeth along his father, and his mother, by means of his staff. The way shall be opened to him that hath power over his feet, and he shall see the Great God in the Boat of Ra, when souls are counted therein at the bows, and when the years also are counted up. Grant that the Eye of Horus, which maketh the adornments of splendour to be firm on the forehead of Ra, may deliver my soul for me, and let darkness cover your faces, O ye who would imprison Osiris. O keep not captive my soul.
The Osiris Ani saith:- The town of Unu is opened. My head is sealed up, Thoth. Perfect is the Eye of Horus. I have delivered the Eye of Horus which shineth with splendours on the brow of Ra, the Father of the gods, [I am] that self-same Osiris, [the dweller in] Amentet. Osiris knoweth his day, and he knoweth that he shall live through his period of life; I shall have by being with him. I am the Moon-god Aah, the dweller among the gods. I shall not come to an end. Stand up therefore, O Horus, for thou art counted among the gods.
Open is the land of Unu. Shut is the head of Thoth. Perfect is the Eye of Horus. I have delivered the Eye of Horus, the shining one, the ornament of the Eye of Ra, the Father of the Gods. I am that same Osiris who dwelleth in Amentet. Osiris knoweth his day, which cometh to an end. I am Set, the Father of the Gods. I shall never come to an end.
The Osiris Ani saith:- I am the Lion-god who cometh forth with long strides. I have shot arrows, and I have wounded my prey. I have shot arrows, and I have wounded my prey. I am the Eye of Horus, I traverse the Eye of Horus at this season. I have arrived at the domains. Grant that the Osiris Ani may come in peace.
I stand up like Horus. I sit down like Ptah. I am strong like Thoth. I am mighty like Tem. I walk with my legs. I speak with my mouth. I chase my enemy. He hath been given unto me, and he shall not be delivered from me.
Thou didst send forth the word when the earth was submerged with silence, O thou Only One, who didst dwell in heaven before ever the earth and the mountains came into being. Hail, thou Runner, Lord, Only One, thou maker of the things that are, thou hast fashioned the tongue of the Company of the Gods, thou hast produced whatsoever cometh forth from the waters, thou springest up out of them above the submerged land of the Lake of Horus
Thou shalt behold Horus standing on the pilot's place in the Boat, and Thoth and Maat shall stand one on each side of him. All the gods shall rejoice when they behold Ra coming in peace to make the hearts of the Spirit- souls to live, and the Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, the assessor of the holy offerings of the Lords of Thebes, shall be with them!
The Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, in peace, whose word is truth, is like Horus, the mighty one of transformations.
Thou givest [thy] face to the Hememet spirits, thou god Khepera who dwellest in thy Boat. Thou hast overthrown the Fiend Aapep. O ye Sons of Keb, overthrow ye the enemies of the Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, and the fiends of destruction who would destroy the Boat of Ra. Horus hath cut off your heads in heaven. Ye who were in the forms of geese, your navel strings are on the earth. The animals are set upon the earth..... in the form of fish.
And behold ye, this god, the mighty one of slaughters, the terror of whom is most great, shall wash himself clean in your blood, and he shall bathe in your gore, and ye shall be destroyed by the Osiris Ani in the Boat of his Lord Ra- Horus
His mother Isis giveth birth to him, and Nephthys nurseth him, just as Isis gave birth to Horus, and Nephthys nursed him. [He] shall repulse the Smait fiends of Suti. They shall see the Urrt Crown stablished upon his head, and they shall fall down upon their faces [and worship him]. Behold, O ye Spirit-souls, and men, and gods, and ye dead, when ye see the Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, in the form of Horus, and the favoured one of the Urrt Crown, fall ye down upon your faces. The word of the Osiris Ani is truth before his enemies in heaven above, and on earth beneath, and before the Tchatchau Chiefs of every god and of every goddess.
Osiris unfettereth the storm-cloud in the body of heaven, and is unfettered himself; Horus is made strong happily each day. He whose transformations are many hath had offerings made unto him at the moment, and he hath made an end of the storm which is in the face of the Osiris, Auf-ankh, whose word is truth. Verily, he cometh, and he is Ra in journeying, and he is the four celestial gods in the heavens above. The Osiris Auf-ankh, whose word is truth, cometh forth in his day, and he embarketh among the tackle of the boat.
I am like Horus, the governor of the Boat, when the throne of his father was given unto him, and when Set, that son of Nut, was [lying] under the fetters which he had made for Osiris. He who is in Sekhem hath inspected me
I am one of the worms which have been created by the Eye of the Lord One. And behold, when as yet Isis had not given birth to Horus, I was flourishing, and I had waxed old, and had become pre-eminent among the Spirit-souls who had come into being with him
I rose up like a divine hawk, and Horus endowed me with a Spirit-body with his soul, so that [I] might take possession of the property of Osiris in the Tuat. He shall say to the twin Lion-gods for me, the Chief of the House of the Nemes Crown, the Dweller in his cavern: Get thee back to the heights of heaven, for behold, inasmuch as thou art a Spirit-body with the creations of Horus, the Nemes Crown shall not be to thee: [but] thou shalt have speech even to the uttermost limits of the heavens. I, the warder, took possession of the property of Horus [which belonged] to Osiris in the Tuat, and Horus repeated to me what his father Osiris had said unto him in the years [past], on the days of his burial.
I come forth therefrom into the House of Isis. I look upon the holy things which are hidden. I see the being who is therein. I speak to the great ones of Shu, they repulse him that is wrathful in his hour. I am Horus who dwelleth in his divine Light. I am master of his crown. I am master of his radiance. I advance towards the Henti boundaries of heaven. Horus is upon his seat. Horus is upon his thrones. My face is like that of a divine hawk. I am one who is equipped [like] his lord. I shall come forth to Tetu. I shall see Osiris. I shall live in his actual presence.... Nut. They shall see me. I shall see the gods [and] the Eye of Horus burning with fire before my eyes. They shall reach out their hands to me. I shall stand up. I shall be master of him that would subject me to restraint. They shall open the holy paths to me, they shall see my form, they shall listen to my words.
Horus hath commanded me to lift up your faces; do ye look upon me. I have risen up like a divine hawk. Horus hath made me to be a Spirit-body by means of his Soul, and to take possession of the things of Osiris in the Tuat. Make ye for me a path. I have travelled and I have arrived at those who are chiefs of their caverns, and who are guardians of the House of Osiris.
I see Osiris. I speak to him concerning the matter of his Great Son, whom he loveth, and concerning [the smiting of] the heart of Set. I look upon the lord who was helpless. How shall I make them to know the plans of the gods, and that which Horus did without the knowledge of his father Osiris?
Thy son Horus hath ascended thy trrone, and all life is with him. Millions of years minister unto him, and millions of years hold him in fear. The Company of the Gods are his servants, and they fold him in fear. The god Tem, the Governor, the only One among the gods, hath spoken, and his word passeth not away. Horus is both the divine food and the sacrifice. He made haste to gather together [the members of] of his father. Horus is his deliverer. Horus is his deliverer. Horus hath sprung from the essence of his divine father and from his decay. He hath become the Governor of Egypt. The gods shall work for him, and they shall toil for him for million of years. He shall make millions of years to live through his Eye, the only one of its lord, Nebertcher.]
Thy son Horus hath ascended thy throne. All life is with him. Millions of years work for him. The Company of the Gods fear him. Tem, the One Power of the Gods, hath spoken, and what he hath said is not changed, Hetu Aabi. Horus hath stood up. I have gone about collecting his father. Horus hath delivered his father. Horus hath delivered [his mother]. My mother is Horus. My brother is Horus. My uncle is Horus. I have come. Horus followeth his father.... there the dirt of his head. The gods shall serve him. Millions of years...... in his Eye, the Only One of its Lord, Neb-er- tcher.
Behold, I am the dweller in his terrors, I am the crocodile, his firstborn. I bring (prey) from a distance. I am the Fish of Horus, the Great One in Kamui. I am the lord of bowings in Sekhem.
I flew up out of primeval matter. I came into being like the god Khepera. I germinated like the plants. I am concealed like the tortoise [in his shell]. I am the seed of every god. I am Yesterday of the Four [Quarters of the Earth, and] the Seven Uraei, who came into being in the Eastern land. [I am] the Great One (Horus) who illumineth the Hememet spirits with the light of his body. [I am] that god in respect of Set. [I am] Thoth who [stood] between them (Horus and Set) as the judge on behalf of the Governor of Sekhem and the Souls of Anu. [He was like] a stream between them. I have come. I rise up on my throne. I am endowed with Khu. I am mighty. I am endowed with godhood among the gods. I am Khensu, [the lord] of every kind of strength.
[Here the word Horus is in parenthesis because it doesn't appear in the text it's implied by the author as well as the other words that appear in brackets]
The Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, saith:- I am the holy lotus that cometh forth from the light which belongeth to the nostrils of Ra, and which belongeth to the head of Hathor. I have made my way, and I seek after him, that is to say, Horus. I am the pure lotus that cometh forth from the field [of Ra].
Thy throne hath descended unto thy son Horus, and the god Tem hath decreed that thy course shall be among the holy princes. In truth he shall rule from thy throne, and he shall be heir to the throne of the Dweller in the fiery Lake [Neserser].
And, verily, his son Horus is seated upon the throne of the Dweller in the fiery Lake [of Neserser], as his heir. I have made him to have his throne in the Boat of Millions of Years. Horus is stablished upon his throne [among his] kinsmen, and he hath all that is with him. Verily, the Soul of Set, which is greater than all the gods, hath departed. Let it be granted to me to bind his soul in fetter in the Boat of the God, when I please, and let him hold the Body of the God in fear. O my father Osiris, thou hast done for me that which thy father Ra did for thee. Let me abide upon the earth permanently. Let me keep possession of my throne. Let my heir be strong. Let my tomb, and my friends who are upon the earth, flourish. Let my enemies be given over to destruction, and to the shackles of the goddess Serq. I am thy son. Ra is my father. On me likewise thou hast conferred life, strength, and health. Horus is established upon his tomb. Grant thou that the days of my life may come unto worship and honour
This Chapter shall be recited over a figure of Horus, made of lapis-lazuli, which shall be placed on the neck of the deceased. It is a protection upon earth, and it will secure for the deceased the affection of men, gods, and the Spirit-souls which are perfect. Moreover it acteth as a spell in Khert-Neter, but it must be recited by thee on behalf of the Osiris Ra, regularly and continually millions of times.
Homage to you, O ye who dwell in your Hall of Maati, who have nothing false in your bodies, who live upon Truth, who feed yourselves upon Truth in the presence of Horus who dwelleth in his Disk, deliver ye me from Beba, who feedeth upon the livers of the great ones on the day of the Great Judgment. Grant ye that I may come before you, for I have not committed sin, I have done no act of deceit, I have done no evil thing, and I have not borne [false] witness; therefore let nothing [evil] be done to me. I have lived upon truth, I have fed upon truth, I have performed the ordinances of men, and the things which gratify the gods. I have propitiated the god by doing his will, I have given bread to the hungry man, and water to him that was athirst, and apparel to the naked man, and a ferry-boat to him that had no boat. I have made propitiatory offerings and given cakes to the gods, and the "things which appear at the word" to the Spirits. Deliver then ye me, protect then ye me, and make ye no report against me in the presence [of the Great God]
Thy cakes shall come from the Utchat (Eye of Horus or Ra), thy ale shall come from the Utchat, and the offerings which shall appear to thee at the word upon earth [shall proceed] from the Utc
The buttocks of the Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, are the buttocks of the Eye of Horus
The head of this Meri-Ra is the head of Horus; he cometh forth therefore and ascendeth into heaven.
He worketh the boat; Pepi cometh forth therefore and ascendeth into heaven. [Pepi is] Horus, the nursling, the child; Meri-Ra cometh forth therefore and ascendeth into heaven
He conducteth him to the House of Horus in the sky. The word of his Double is truth before Keb
My buttocks are the buttocks of the Eye of Horus.
I am he who cometh forth advancing, whose name is unknown. I am Yesterday. "Seer of Millions of Years" is my name. I pass along, I pass along the paths of the divine celestial judges. I am the Lord of Eternity: I decree and I judge like Khepera. I am the Lord of the Urrt Crown. I am he who dwelleth in the Utchat and in the Egg, and it is granted unto me to live therein. I am he who dwelleth in the Utchat when it closeth, and I exist by the strength thereof. I come forth and I shine; I enter in and I come to life. I am in the Utchat, my seat is upon my throne, and I sit in the tent chamber before it. I am Horus. [I] traverse millions of years. I have decreed [the stablishing] of my throne, and I am the ruler thereof; and in very truth my mouth keepeth an even balance both in speech and in silence. In very truth my forms are inverted. I am Un-Nefer, from one period even unto another, and what I have is within me. I am the only One, who proceedeth from an only One, who goeth round about in his course. I am he who dwelleth in the Utchat. No evil thing of any shape or kind shall spring up against me, and no baleful object, and no harmful thing, and no disastrous thing shall happen unto me. I open the door in heaven. I rule my throne. I open the way for the births which take place on this day. I am the child who traverseth the road of Yesterday. I am To-day for untold nations and peoples. I am he who protecteth you for millions of years. Whether ye be denizens of heaven, or of the earth, or of the South, or of the North, or of the East, or of the West, the fear of me is in your bodies. I am he whose being hath been wrought in his eye. I shall not die again. My moment is in your bodies, but my forms are in my place of habitation. I am "He who cannot be known." The Red Fiends have their faces directed against me. I am the unveiled one. The period when the heavens were created for me and were enlarged the bounds of earth, and multiplied the progeny thereof, cannot be found out. They shall fail and not be united again. By reason of the speech which I address to you, my name setteth itself apart from all things evil which are in the mouths of men. I am he who riseth and shineth, a wall which cometh out of a wall, an only One who proceedeth from an only One. There is never a day that passeth without the things which appertain unto him being therein; passing, passing, passing, passing. Verily I say unto thee, I am the Plant which cometh forth from Nu, and my mother is Nut. Hail, my creator, I am he who hath no power to walk, the Great Knot who dwelleth in Yesterday. The might of my strength is within my hand, I am not known [by thee], but I am he who knoweth thee. I cannot be held in the hand, but I am he who can hold thee in his hand. Hail, O Egg! Hail, O Egg! I am Horus who liveth for millions of years, whose flame shineth upon you, and bringeth your hearts unto me. I am master of my throne. I advance at this season. I have opened a path. I have delivered myself from all evil things. I am the golden dog-headed ape, three palms and two fingers [high], which hath neither arms nor legs, and which dwelleth in Het-ka-Ptah. I go forth as goeth forth the dog-headed ape who dwelleth in Het-ka-Ptah.
Horus, the son of Isis, shall rejoice when he seeth him. [No] road shall be blocked to him. His hand shall be to heaven, his hand shall be to earth, for ever. Do not let anyone see him. Verily....
If this book be done for him, the magical spells of Isis shall protect him, and Horus the son of Isis shall rejoice [when] he seeth him. No road shall be blocked to him. His hand shall be to heaven, his hand shall be to earth....... If this book be known by him he shall be in the following of Osiris Un-Nefer, and his word shall be truth in Khert- Neter. The doors in Khert-Neter shall be opened to him. Wheat and barley shall be given to him in Sekhet-Aanru. His name shall be like [the names of] the gods who are there, the Followers of Horus who reap.
Thou art Horus, the son of Hathor, Nesert, Nesertet, who giveth back the head after it hath been cut off. Thy head shall not be carried away from thee, after [it hath been cut off]; thy head shall be carried away from thee, never, never!
Thy word is truth in respect of what hath been done unto thee. Ptah hath overthrown thy foes, and thou art Horus, the son of Hathor.]
I am thy son Horus, who loveth thee. I come to avenge thee, O my father Osiris, upon him that did evil unto thee. I have set him under thy feet for ever and for ever, permanently, permanently, O Osiris Ani, whose word is truth, whose word is truth.
Horus vanquished Set when [he] looked at the building of Sekhet-Hetepet. [He] spread air over the Divine Soul in its Egg, in its day. He delivered the interior of the body of Horus [from the Akeru Gods]. I have crowned him in the House of Shu. His house is the stars. Behold, I take up my place in its nomes. He hath guided the hearts of the Company of the Firstborn Gods. He hath reconciled the Two Fighters (Horus and Set),
Set vanguished Horus, who was looking at the building in Sekhet- Hetepet. I set free Horus from Set. Set opened the paths of the Two Eyes (the Sun and Moon) in the sky. Set ejected water with air upon the soul of his Eye, which dwelt in the town of Mert; he delivered the interior of the body of Horus from the hands of the Akeru Gods. Behold me! I paddle this great boat over the Lake of the god Hetep; I seized upon it in the mansion of Shu. The mansion of his stars reneweth youth, reneweth youth. I paddle over the Lakes thereof so that I may arrive at the towns thereof. I sail up to the town of the god Hetep.... Behold, I am at peace with his times, and with his guidance, and with his will, and with the Company of the Gods, who are his firstborn. He maketh the Two Fighters (Horus and Set) to be at peace [with each other], and to keep ward over the living whom he hath created in fair form, and he bringeth peace; he maketh the Two Fighters to be at peace with those who watch over them. He cutteth off the hair from their divine fighters, he driveth away storm from the children
[What liars those egyptologists are. Horus was never crucified, he was slain by Set!]
Horus maketh himself strong like unto a hawk which is one thousand cubits in length, and two thousand cubits in life. He that equipments with him, he journeyeth on, he cometh to the place where his heart would be, among the Lakes which are in its towns. He begetteth in the birth-chamber of the god of the town, he is satisfied with the food of the god of the town; he doeth what ought to be done there, in the Field of Smas-er-Khet..... everything of the birth-chamber of the god of the town. Now [when he] setteth in the [land of] life like crystal he performeth everything therein, [which things are] like unto the things done in the Lake Neserser, wherein there is none that rejoiceth, and wherein are evil things of all kinds.
Behold it (the fire) riseth in Abtu, and it cometh; I cause it to come, the Eye of Horus. It is set in order upon thy brow
The Eye of Horus protecteth thee, O Osiris Khenti-Amenti, and it keepeth thee in safety; it casteth down headlong all thine enemies for thee, and all thine enemies have fallen down headlong before thee.
The Eye of Horus cometh. It is sound and well, it sendeth forth light even as doth Ra in the horizon. It covereth the powers of Suti with darkness, it mastereth him, and it bringeth its flame against him by its own command. The Eye of Horus is sound and well, thou eatest the flesh thereof, thy body possesseth it. Thou acclaimest it
Hail, ye sons of Horus, Kesta, Hapi, Tuamutef, and Qebhsenuf, ye have given your protection to your divine Father Osiris Khenti-Amenti, give ye your protection to the Osiris Nu, whose word is truth. Now therefore, inasmuch as ye have destroyed the Opponent of Osiris Khenti-Amenti, who liveth with the gods, having smitten Suti with his right hand and arm when dawn came upon the earth, and Horus hath become master [of Suti], and hath avenged his divine Father himself; and inasmuch as your divine Father hath been made to flourish through the union of the KA of Osiris Khenti-Amenti, whch ye effected, and the Eye of Horus hath avenged him, and hath protected him, and hath cast down headlong for him all his enemies, and all his enemies have fallen down before him, even so do ye destroy the Opponent of the Osiris Nu, the steward of the overseer of the seal, whose word is truth. Let him live with the gods, let him smite his enemy, let him destroy him, when light dawneth on the earth. Let Horus be master and avenge the Osiris Nu, and let the Osiris Nu flourish through his union with his KA which ye have effected. O Osiris Nu, the Eye of Horus hath avenged thee. It hath cast down headlong all thine enemies for thee, and all thine enemies have been cast down headlong before thee.
Hail, Osiris Khenti-Amenti, grant thou light and fire to the perfect Heart-soul which is in Hensu. And [O ye Sons of Horus], grant ye power unto the living heart-soul of the Osiris Nu by means of his fire
RUBRIC: [This Chapter] shall be recited over four torches of atma cloth, which hath been anointed with the finest Thehennu unguent, and the torches shall be placed in the hands of four men who shall have the names of the pillars of Horus written upon their shoulders,
Whew!!! FINALLY. Finished with that futile and useless chore. I've heard this argument from egyptologists for over 12 years now and the similarities have not increased. There are some subtle similarities but not enough to say Ishua was plagiarized from the story of Horus.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Yehochanan Ben-Yisrael on -
Shalom,
We must beware of “reading someone else’s mail”.
Those who espouse the Kemetic and other ancient writings read them with no understanding. In order to read “anything”, the person must know the definition of the words and the context of the writing. It is HUGE mistake to read anything from a foreign culture without understanding the meaning. And that meaning can only be understood by an authentic teacher in that lineage of teachers. So, there is no need to even try to interpret the Kemetic books to disprove them. Not only do we not understand them, the Kemetic people do not either.
So, basically, the average Kemetic metaphysicians still remain in the culture or spiritual tradition that they came from. For instance, Muata Ashby studied Yoga and Vedanta with Swami Jyotirmayananda in Miami. Then, all he did is apply swap the Sanskrit terminology with Kemetic terminology and then added his own stuff. Since Vedanta and the Kemetic writings are similar, they believe that it gives them license to interpret the texts as they please. Ra Un Nefer Amen was a Rosicrucian. Again, he just changed the Rosicrucian terminology to Kemetic and copied the rituals. I know because I studied with the Ancient Mystical Order of the Rosicrucians for a year. VERY ORIGINAL! I see right through it.
And of course the Kemetic science will be similar to Christianity since the Greek religion came directly from Kemet. So, of course there will be similarities in the Christian theology and that of ancient Kemet.
The Torah has no relation to any other spiritual system. Some site the correspondences of Yeshua with astrology. Well, since astrology is a near-science based on the celestial bodies, of course Yeshua will be present. But, astrology is only accurate in a general way. The Jewish sages commented heavily on this. Astrology has no affect on Torah-observant Israel whatsoever.
That is all I have on it.
Shalom,
Yehochanan
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Permalink Reply by Eemah Khephzybah on -
I am certain all have seen the Esoteric Agenda. This video is available online in its fullness. It is most disturbing to me. The Shephard of the Assembly where I once attended shared the DVD with us. After a week of reviewing, I finally had to give it up but because we opt to ignore it does not mean its assertions are untrue or will not occur.
Here is one part of it that if you carefully listen, touches on much that has been discussed here.
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Permalink Reply by Eemah Khephzybah on
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Also, I forgot to paste the post from the other discussion thread as I promised. Brother Yehochanan Ben-Yisrael did an extraordinary job explaining the video that was in that posting. Also Moreh KhazaqYah Ben Yisrael presented an interesting interpretation of the Book of Enoch that I am still trying to better understand.
http://hisspace.ning.com/group/qodeshyahrushalayim/forum/topics/exp...
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Permalink Reply by Eemah Khephzybah on
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A sister friend sent this to me today. I have to share it for whatever its value. Too many similarities. I did ask her for documentation on Horus for she is a Hebrew Kemetologist. She observe Torah but connects it to Egypt. I do not understand but I see lots of it recently.
Deep Similarities - Do you think its ALL made up?
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Permalink Reply by Yehochanan Ben-Yisrael on
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when people send you this sort of information, make sure you request the source texts.
i have not seen any of the information in the video about horus in the egyptian texts i have read. the only similarity are GENERAL truths found in every religion that pick good versus evil.
and there is no such thing as "December 25" on any egyptian calendar i ever heard of. the vast majority of almanacs at that time were LUNAR and not at all based on the solstices and equinoxes. the winter solstice (dec. 25) had no significance. only the spring equinox meant anything since it is was used to mark keep the lunar calender in line season on most ancient almanacs.
basically, the sister is probably just impressed by some cleverly written books she has read. since they assume that christians is based on the kemetic religion, they just invent kemetic history to make it fit. i have asked the kemetic people to prove their belief from any kemetic source texts and they cannot do it. it is all hearsay.
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Permalink Reply by Eemah Khephzybah on
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I do agree with this point. Since it was made by Brother Wondell in the other thread, I have been reading Egyptian Sources and found some interesting pieces on Heru that I believed was too close for comfort but not as much as has been listed or claimed in videos like the one I posted. So, I am in communications with a Hebrew sister who is also Kemetologist priestess. She promised to share with me documentation on how the Greeks distorted Kemetic writings and philosophy and used it to create their own version of Greek mythology which was later used by Roman philosophers in creating Christianity. Wow... what a mouthful.
Until that point, I do not take the Zeitgist stuff so to heart as I use to. Praise Yah. BUT... I will be honest Brother Wondell none of the debuking videos offered much hope. Several of us seekers searched for material to dispell the Ziegist stuff and we viewed lots of debuking videos and they simply were uneffective debates. Not one claimed any of the facts suggested by Brother Yehochanan above. I think it is because they were looking at Greek stuff and never studied Kemetic Writings. This is what I find one must do to deal with this argument or issue. If the sister sends me material that is worth sharing, I will do so. Thanks for the updates on this.
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Permalink Reply by Wondell on -
What you have there is nothing more than a portion of a very popular online film called Zeitgeist. That Movie has been debunked by sooo many people.
If this isn't good enough for you. Google "zeitgeist debunked"
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Permalink Reply by Eemah Khephzybah on
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This is a great video and one of the best ones I have seen with the debunking mission. I must say that it is not so impressive to me. Again too many issues of similarities that are glossed over. No different than perhaps what is claimed about the Zeigist. My daughter and I watched this video together and unfortunately, it gave her more fuel for dispelling the bible.
I think that it is what you bring to the table that will discredit or credit videos like these. I try so hard to be open mind and blank but I am neither. To be honest, no one can probably convince me that there is not truth in the Ziegist stuff but at the same time, like my buddy Dr. Kwesi, I believe it is the commentaries of the truth that may bring forth the distortions.
I know for a fact, many when seeing this video who ignored the Ziegist before will begin to rethink that they must have a point- simply because there are too many glossing over of issues. First of all to point out how many times someone's work is cited is kind of a weak defense tactic. Most writers uses the same sources numerous times in their documentaries. Therefore, this happens very often. I have not seen the Zeigist movie but work like this would encourage one to do so. Perhaps not Christians who fear anything challenging their belief systems but most Truth seekers would step out and seek. Using prayer and reason, you will be lead to one path or the other. Thank you for sharing.
Now.... did you see Esoteric Agenda? Not so easily refuted... in fact this video supports it a great deal - doesn't it?
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Permalink Reply by Wondell on
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Wow, I'm starting to wonder, did we watch the same video. I actually had to check to see if I embedded the correct video. Perhaps the problem is the criterion for truth and fact. Perhaps you have a different standard than I do. What I saw in this video was VERY compelling to me. I don't know what your daughter is looking for or ignoring, same goes for you. I don't know. But it appears that the Whispers have converted your heart based on similarities alone and no evidence to support those likenesses.
What I like about this video is:
* It cites the source materials for making these allegations against the scriptures and shows that those who promulgate this information piggyback off the "scholarship" of others and basically piece-meal their information without having researched themselves.
* It then discredit those sources and not only show the character flaws of those individuals but the flaws in their scholarship. All of which are european authors by the way.
* It then goes into all these supposed saviors and show how the "similarities" that exist are nothing but hyperbole and inaccurate. Showing forth that The "similarities" are presupposed and don't exist even in the texts from which they are said to have come. It spends a great deal on Horus and said that of all of them he posed the greatest threat. However once dissected we find that the similarities that most of the more important similarities are fudged and inaccurate. Not to mention there are many stories of horus and many gods named horus. They show that there aren't any stories prior to Messiah where there are similarities. All the documents that show similarities between Horus and Messiah post date Messiah. Thats an IMPORTANT word for me POSTDATE which mean came AFTER. The author of the video shows that Horus and his attributes changed from one dynasty to another. How in one dynasty he was important and in another he took a backseat to Ra. This is important because it means that his - Horus's story has been reworked and retooled to fit the moment. There are even ATHEISTS, and Non-Christian sources that reject the claims of plagiarism or borrowing. Thats powerful
* He then goes and dissects the other supposed saviors and show the inaccuracies within their descriptions and how again their accounts have been retooled and reworked POSTDATING christianity
* He then gives evidence of the existence of Messiah and thru extra biblical (books that aren't part of the bible) sources show that history recognizes this man as having existed. Everyone from Roman officials to Historians. Yet these other supposed saviors can't even be proven to have existed and we find that AFTER the birth of Christianity that these similarities are born.
* The video disproves the astrological similiarities (well I still say the gospel is in the sky and can be read using the zodiac) but the outrageous astrological references.
* This video shows that those who try to find these similarities try to do so with supposed legends within christianity, for example "The 3 Kings that came to visit Jesus" The scripture NEVER said there were 3 kings. There were 3 types of Gifts but not 3 kings. They were Magi not Kings. So thats even further proof that these supposed ancient stories were reworked and retooled to appear similar to Christianity. And when it come to horus I'm STILL waiting for someone to show me that he was baptized, that he was born on Dec 25. I said in another post that it would be impossible to find out what Horus's birthday was since Egypt had both a solar and a lunar calendar and the month December didn't exist on the egyptian calendar but was certainly called another name. What makes it even more difficult is that December used to the 10th month prior to the addition of the 2 roman Gods to the calendar. And this you can tell when you start looking at the months from september:
Septe means 7
Nove -mber Means 9
Oct - ber Means 8
Deca -mber means 10
What may not appear to you and your daughter is these little things are proofs and evidence that these stories of these supposed dieties are trying to fashion themselves after Christianity. Or shall we say when these religions had their renaissance they tried to resurrect themselves and achieve popularity by copying the christian prototype. I don't know, maybe because I think like a scholar it jumps out at me. Not saying that you don't, but similarities alone is not evidence. I think these people realize that the to the laymen thats enough to convince them of "foulplay" and thats why they focus so hard on that and have even twisted the trust to make there appear to be similarities where there are none. Because to your average person thats enough to steal them away. But scholars are no so easily convinced.
I'm proud of this video, they have done their homework. And to me, because I know what criterion are required to make thing true or false or to refute a thing, they did an excellent job. I say they could have been stronger in some areas and left somethings to be desired in others. They got a lil too christianity and evangelical for me in the end. But all in all, when it came to the facts they were spot on.
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Permalink Reply by Eemah Khephzybah on
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Its all about one's threshold for reasoning I suppose because the astrological parts were not resolve by far... using my threshold and my bar is not so high but does require something other than conjecture.
Yeshua as messiah is seldomly an argument of anyone. It is him as God or a deity that seems to cause the arguments. Proving him as a prophet or messiah takes little work for any one to do. Who refutes this anyway?
To say that two fish feeding five thousand has nothing to do with the symbol of pisces in words only - is not much of an argument to me but perhaps it depends on what you want to believe or how high is your threshold of reasoning.
I like the video and will add it to my collection but for debunking the Zeigeests stuff... I give it a 4!
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Permalink Reply by Wondell on
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As I said it's all upon one's own criterion for proof. I guess in the recesses of my mind I can sit back and watch this video and go "ah haahh!!!" because I don't need much convincing as I've done much of this research myself and just loved the way they put it together so succinctly.
2 fish? lol.umm ok lol. What about when it performed the miracle again with a FEW small fish. Few is more than 2. Then what does the bread represent astrologically? See I don't see how that can correlate at ALL. Thats enough to convince YOU but thats not nearly enough evidence to convince ME of having ANYTHING to do with Pisces. No connection whatsoever. There are too many unanswered questions and not enough evidence to show how this is supposed to even be significant in any form or fashion. I mean what is that supposed to be saying? That they stole the story from The constellation of Pisces?
I mean the movie spends a lot of time debunking the astrological correlations and I thought it did a good job showing that the only connection to Messiah and fish is the Christian symbol for the fish was actually the initials of the his sentence inscription which spelled the word Fish and thereby became the symbol. My goodness.
I have a vast knowledge of ancient symbology and iconoglasms. So when I see these things I can't settle on such a narrow view because symbols had a plethora of meaning in the ancient world particularly in the east. And RARELY did they have ANYTHING to do with zodiology. Fish meant life or rebirth not pisces which the costellation got it's name from Athena and Enos who were supposedly great fish swimming apart in the ocean and all that greek mythology bunk.
What people either don't know or tend to forget is that EACH culture had their OWN astrological signs. Some similar and some dissimilar. Hebrew astrology got it's symbology from this:
Gen 49:1 ¶ And Jacob called unto his sons, and said, Gather yourselves together, that I may tell you [that] which shall befall you in the last days.
Gen 49:2 Gather yourselves together, and hear, ye sons of Jacob; and hearken unto Israel your father.
Gen 49:3 Reuben, thou [art] my firstborn, my might, and the beginning of my strength, the excellency of dignity, and the excellency of power:
Gen 49:4 Unstable as water, thou shalt not excel; because thou wentest up to thy father's bed; then defiledst thou [it]: he went up to my couch.
Gen 49:5 Simeon and Levi [are] brethren; instruments of cruelty [are in] their habitations.
Gen 49:6 O my soul, come not thou into their secret; unto their assembly, mine honour, be not thou united: for in their anger they slew a man, and in their selfwill they digged down a wall.
Gen 49:7 Cursed [be] their anger, for [it was] fierce; and their wrath, for it was cruel: I will divide them in Jacob, and scatter them in Israel.
Gen 49:8 Judah, thou [art he] whom thy brethren shall praise: thy hand [shall be] in the neck of thine enemies; thy father's children shall bow down before thee.
Gen 49:9 Judah [is] a lion's whelp: from the prey, my son, thou art gone up: he stooped down, he couched as a lion, and as an old lion; who shall rouse him up?
Gen 49:10 The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him [shall] the gathering of the people [be].
Gen 49:11 Binding his foal unto the vine, and his ass's colt unto the choice vine; he washed his garments in wine, and his clothes in the blood of grapes:
Gen 49:12 His eyes [shall be] red with wine, and his teeth white with milk.
Gen 49:13 Zebulun shall dwell at the haven of the sea; and he [shall be] for an haven of ships; and his border [shall be] unto Zidon.
Gen 49:14 Issachar [is] a strong ass couching down between two burdens:
Gen 49:15 And he saw that rest [was] good, and the land that [it was] pleasant; and bowed his shoulder to bear, and became a servant unto tribute.
Gen 49:16 Dan shall judge his people, as one of the tribes of Israel.
Gen 49:17 Dan shall be a serpent by the way, an adder in the path, that biteth the horse heels, so that his rider shall fall backward.
Gen 49:18 I have waited for thy salvation, O LORD.
Gen 49:19 Gad, a troop shall overcome him: but he shall overcome at the last.
Gen 49:20 Out of Asher his bread [shall be] fat, and he shall yield royal dainties.
Gen 49:21 Naphtali [is] a hind let loose: he giveth goodly words.
Gen 49:22 Joseph [is] a fruitful bough, [even] a fruitful bough by a well; [whose] branches run over the wall:
Gen 49:23 The archers have sorely grieved him, and shot [at him], and hated him:
Gen 49:24 But his bow abode in strength, and the arms of his hands were made strong by the hands of the mighty [God] of Jacob; (from thence [is] the shepherd, the stone of Israel:)
Gen 49:25 [Even] by the God of thy father, who shall help thee; and by the Almighty, who shall bless thee with blessings of heaven above, blessings of the deep that lieth under, blessings of the breasts, and of the womb:
Gen 49:26 The blessings of thy father have prevailed above the blessings of my progenitors unto the utmost bound of the everlasting hills: they shall be on the head of Joseph, and on the crown of the head of him that was separate from his brethren.
Gen 49:27 Benjamin shall ravin [as] a wolf: in the morning he shall devour the prey, and at night he shall divide the spoil.
I could go into this but I already did in another thread and that would be too much for casual reading. Symbols for water creature and bread can be found right here. We have no need for pisces.
Then too did you not know that Cancer the Sign for Crab USED to be The Dung Beetle or Scarab. And the sign for Scorpio USED to be the Eagle. It wasn't until 90AD when the egyptian born Ptolemy was born that things started to become standardized as we know it today.
Astrology and astronomy are accredited to the Babylonians. The Antediluvian Calendar in Genesis 5 illustrates the early Black Head Sumerian zodiac that had six astrological signs. Sumerian and Babylonian animal zodiacs stipulate the vernal equinox began the New Year. Mayan Calendar 260-day-Tzolken-sacred-years and 360-day-Tun-years are products of the Decan stars and numbering systems. Egyptian, Greek, Roman, Chinese, Hindu and African people shared a 12-month zodiac. Numerically matching 364-day-Ethiopic-years with 364-year-Ethiopic-cycles demonstrates astrology in ancient religion.
Some calendars had 13 months, some had 12, some had 10, some had 6. Pisces is the 12 sign of the zodiac since it starts at Aries :O) [that would be me]. So in some cases pisces would have been left off all together.
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